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Zion - Russell Gulch/Subway - Sun. 6/15 - partners needed!

Discussion in 'Meet Up' started by Juan Gutierrez, Jun 10, 2014.

  1. Juan Gutierrez

    Juan Gutierrez

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    Location:
    Farmington, NM
    Two friends and myself are looking for 3 other people to join us on Sunday 6/15 for The Subway + Russell Gulch. I have a permit for six people but half of our group backed out at the last minute. We'll be camping in Zion Saturday night. Let me know if you're interested and I'll provide my contact info.

    Thanks!

    JCG
    Mountaineer likes this.
  2. Redrockhikerboy

    Redrockhikerboy

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    Juan, Russell Gulch is OKAY as a start to the dynamite Subway (adds technical spice to an otherwise non technical, standard, approach) BUT Das Boot is a super exciting and intimately narrow and watery start and in my opinion it trumps the Russell Gulch start. Wetsuits are pretty much mandatory, and you do need to get it onto your permit, but I believe its combined into one permit with Subway and so additional monies are not required. There are some great Das Boot trip reports on this site. For me, these days anyway, I find the Das Boot section of the Das Boot/Subway route to be the better of the two sections.
  3. Redrockhikerboy

    Redrockhikerboy

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    duplicate post
  4. Juan Gutierrez

    Juan Gutierrez

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    Location:
    Farmington, NM
    Thanks for the info...when I was looking at Zion I wasn't sure which approach was the best, and unfortunately hadn't found this site yet?

    I already pulled permits for Russell Gulch/Subway for this Sunday 6/15 and had three people in my group back out...so basically just looking for 3 people interested in joining us!

  5. Juan Gutierrez

    Juan Gutierrez

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    Location:
    Farmington, NM
    I changed our approach to Das Boot based on everyone's suggestions...still have 2 open spots on my Subway permit for this Sunday 6/15.

    Any takers???
  6. Redrockhikerboy

    Redrockhikerboy

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    Juan, have a great trip. The Das Boot section will add some time to your subway trip, probably a couple of hours--well worth it in my opinion--but beware you will need the extra time. Its also chilly down there so if you own a suit, bring it and if you dont, rent one definitely. Again, in my opinion. Lastly, if you havent yet done so, check out the beta for the entrance to to Das Boot. It starts similarly to the regular russell gulch subway approach but veers off that route, across slickrock, and you need to know where to drop into the boot. If I can do it pretty much anyone can do it, but by all means check out at least one beta source--and two or more are better. Be safe and enjoy.
    Chris
  7. Jolly Green

    Jolly Green

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    Location:
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    You need 2 permits to do this- one for Das Boot and one for the Subway. Same for Russell.
  8. Redrockhikerboy

    Redrockhikerboy

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    I am pretty sure the NPS can create one permit which features the das boot start and the subway proper exit. Unless I am delirious (possibly) that's what my permit was--a single permit for both segments of the canyon.
  9. Redrockhikerboy

    Redrockhikerboy

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    Juan and Jolly Green--
    I just checked out the zion permits page and I did not see the das boot/subway combo. In years past I believe there was a way to click on das boot and choose the subway as an exit...or click subway and choose das boot as an entrance. I am not seeing that currently, however. Since others have been through the permitting process more recently than I (I havent been to Zion in over a year), perhaps someone will chime in on this matter.
    Chris
  10. Jolly Green

    Jolly Green

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    Location:
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    2 permits. As of right now, there will be no problem getting a permit for Russell. Looks like there are currently only 4 spots available for Das Boot on Sunday, although there should be more available this afternoon after the "last minute drawing" that no one has entered occurs. That should open up the remaining spots you will need. Good luck.
  11. Juan Gutierrez

    Juan Gutierrez

    Messages:
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    Location:
    Farmington, NM
    I have separate permits for Subway and Das Boot...got them separately b/c I didn't know which approach I would take at the time I purchased. I still have 2 open spots on each...I'll return them to the NPS soon if no one is interested in joining us...my friend and I were hoping to partner up w/ someone who has done the route before.
  12. Redrockhikerboy

    Redrockhikerboy

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    I located it on the NPS site...if you select das boot it will ask you for your intended exit...you can choose up russell gulch (not the technical section, the regular hiking section up and out) OR down the subway section...so you can do both for the price of one.

    I copied and pasted this from the das boot reservation page:
    Select one itinerary from below*
    Das Boot - exit Russell Gulch.
    Wildcat Canyon Trailhead (Begin Trip) »
    Upper Left Fork (Das Boot) (0 nights) »
    Wildcat Canyon Trailhead (End Trip)
    Das Boot - Travel down Subway, Exit Left Fork Trailhead.
    Wildcat Canyon Trailhead (Begin Trip) »
    Upper Left Fork (Das Boot) (0 nights) »
    Left Fork North Creek (SUBWAY) (0 nights) »
    Left Fork Trailhead (Subway) (End Trip)
  13. Redrockhikerboy

    Redrockhikerboy

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    I am old, but I knew I wasnt loosing it that badly.
    Juan Gutierrez likes this.
  14. Ram

    Ram

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    Das Boot is an .8 of a mile section of the Left Fork of North Creek. The idea that it should be a separate permit is absurd. Over managed system, in this case, created by the public asking for a permit to the place (unfortunate) that is part of the same drainage, that has a made up name. All because someone wrote a story about this short section. Crazy, crazy stuff. Watch out what you ask for!
    The story for anyone not versed yet.
    http://www.math.utah.edu/~sfolias/canyontales/tale/?i=dasboot
    Tyler likes this.
  15. Jolly Green

    Jolly Green

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    Location:
    Farmington, UT
    The Das Boot reservation page says this-

    Upper Left Fork (Das Boot) Information:Wet / dry suits necessary for all seasons. Subway permit required for downstream travel continuing through Left Fork.

    Juan will be fine since he said he has a reservation for both canyons. Perhaps the issuing ranger can combine it into a one page permit with only one fee- I hope that they have enough common sense to do so. I didn't pick up the permit when we did it, so I don't know what the paper they actually hand you looks like.

    My point here is made to all the people reading this not named Juan that you better have a Das Boot permit AND a Subway permit or Ranger Ray won't like you too much. Simply clicking on the "Exit down Subway" tab when making your Das Boot reservation isn't enough.

    Go Heat!!!
  16. 2065toyota

    2065toyota

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    2 weekends ago we got checked by a ranger at the point where das boot and subway entrance join


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
  17. Redrockhikerboy

    Redrockhikerboy

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    Boy, I stand wayyy corrected. My apologies to anyone I may have been misdirecting with my misinformation regarding permitting for das boot and subway. I know I did it off of one permit last year, but I must have paid twice. The NPS confirmed via phone (no, nobody answered the phone but they did return my call a few hours later) that the two reservations for the two separate permits would be combined when the permit was picked up, thus one permit but two permit fees for two canyon segments. I liked it better the way it worked out in my misunderstanding/fantasy of one permit and one price for the whole shebang. Darn.
  18. 2065toyota

    2065toyota

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    The way that it really should be. It's the same canyon.


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  19. Mountaineer

    Mountaineer Is that an X slot?

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    Last year we were checked at the same point.
  20. ratagonia

    ratagonia

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    Location:
    Mount Carmel, Utah
    Uh, it would be nice... and it is because that is the way that it IS.

    You pay to make a reservation. Perhaps you paid once for a Subway reservation and a second time for a Das Boot Reservation.

    When you picked up the PERMIT, you paid once for the permit.

    The rule is, if you don't ride in a vehicle, it is still one trip and only requires one permit. Imlay and Heaps in a day - one permit. Telephone and Behunin - one permit. Right Fork/Left Fork - with no vehicle inbetween, one permit.

    The reason they are two different quota areas is that the SUBWAY is a special, high-use zone, and Das BOOT is not. They have different rules associated with them. Thus, they are different. As they should be.

    Tom
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