Send us a suggestion!

Rappelling on dyneema or kevlar accessory cords

Discussion in 'Archives - Yahoo Canyons Group' started by Michele Angileri, Sep 5, 2002.

  1. Hello everybody. I'm Michele Angileri from Italy and this is my first post since I subscribed this list about one year ago ...

    My problem is to find light ropes for rappelling (canyoning). Of course I'm searching for ropes resistant to abrasion. Till now I'm using 9-10mm polyammide ropes as "Superstatic" by Ederlid or "Statix" by Cousin. Strong sheath is a very important feature in my opinion. Rigidity is another one.

    I'm asking to myself why not use ropes made of aramide (kevlar) or polyethilene (dyneema). 6 mm accessory cords made of kevlar or dyneema have the same breaking load as a 9-10 mm polyammide rope, but are much lighter.

    I made a very rough test to compare a 10 mm Ederlid Superstatic and a 5.5 mm kevlar (core) accessory cord by Beal. It showed Beal kevlar is much more resistant to abrasion than Superstatic, but its sheath (not made of kevlar) broke before Ederlid sheat.

    1) What do you think about? 2) Have you any experience in rappelling on this kind of accessory cords? Can you tell experiences you heard from other people? 3) Can you advice some website? 4) Can you suggest me a very strong low-diameter low-weight rope? 5) Can you suggest me a kevlar or dyneema (or so) accessory cord with its sheath made of the same material?

    Michele
  2. rcwildone

    rcwildone Guest

    Michele,

    Unfortunately, neither dyneema (aka spectra in the U.S.) or kevlar are good choices for rope/cord fibers. Both fibers have a very high strength to weight ration, but they also have some negative characteristics.

    Dyneema/spectra has a low melting point, so the heat of a descending device can be harmful. Therefore, a rope/cord made from 100% dyneema/spectra should not be used. BlueWater recently introduced an 8mm rope called the Canyon Pro with a spectra core and a polyester sheath. The polyester sheath provides protection from heat and additional abrasion resistance. It also holds the price down a bit; a 100% spectra rope would be very expensive.

    Kevlar fibers are brittle and have poor "flex endurance". The fibers are strong when pulled in line, but as soon as you tie a knot in a kevlar rope, it is weaker than nylon. And, because the fibers are brittle, sooner or later they will break. Kevlar is not a good choice, even if only used in the core of a rope/cord.

    I have used canyoning ropes made by Beal, Cousin and Millet, as well as most American-made static ropes. By far, my favorites are the new BlueWater ropes (8mm Canyon Pro and 9.2mm Canyon). Not sure if they are available in Europe yet, but if you can get your hands on one, do it.

    Rich
  3. Bo Beck

    Bo Beck Guest

    On a different note Michele, I will be flying in to Montebelluna on Oct 16, and spending a few days there on business, but then a friend and I will head north for a few days to do some hiking. I was particularly interested in finding a Via Feratta. Do you have any information or sources that you may suggest?

    Thanks,

    Bo

    ----- Original Message ----- From: Michele Angileri mangiler@thunder.it> To: <Yahoo Canyons Group> Sent: Thursday, September 05, 2002 5:39 PM Subject: [from Canyons Group] Rappelling on dyneema or kevlar accessory cords

    > Hello everybody. I'm Michele Angileri from Italy and this is my first post > since I subscribed this list about one year ago ...
    My problem is to find light ropes for rappelling (canyoning). Of course I'm > searching for ropes resistant to abrasion. Till now I'm using 9-10mm > polyammide ropes as "Superstatic" by Ederlid or "Statix" by Cousin. Strong > sheath is a very important feature in my opinion. Rigidity is another one.
    I'm asking to myself why not use ropes made of aramide (kevlar) or > polyethilene (dyneema). 6 mm accessory cords made of kevlar or dyneema have > the same breaking load as a 9-10 mm polyammide rope, but are much lighter.
    I made a very rough test to compare a 10 mm Ederlid Superstatic and a 5.5 mm > kevlar (core) accessory cord by Beal. It showed Beal kevlar is much more > resistant to abrasion than Superstatic, but its sheath (not made of kevlar) > broke before Ederlid sheat.
    1) What do you think about? > 2) Have you any experience in rappelling on this kind of accessory cords? > Can you tell experiences you heard from other people? > 3) Can you advice some website? > 4) Can you suggest me a very strong low-diameter low-weight rope? > 5) Can you suggest me a kevlar or dyneema (or so) accessory cord with its > sheath made of the same material?
    > Michele

    > When you post, please change the Subject appropriately, to make reading and searching easier. You can use the following abbreviations: TRIP = Trip Report; BETA = Canyon Beta; PARTNER = Partner and/or Rides; ETHICS = Ethics; TECH = Technical Questions and Tips; BIZ = E Group Business; SALE = Stuff for Sale. Please use a Tilde ~ after the abbreviation, so we know you are coding for us, such as:
    Subject: BIZ~ New Abbreviation List - working?
    Bombastic Bolt Debates are allowed to only a limited extent. Folks should go to the Canyoneer Group for a truly un-moderated forum. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/canyoneer
    > To change your delivery options, go to the Canyons Egroup page on yahoo: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/canyons/
    > This will require logging into Yahoo. Click on the &amp;amp;quot;Edit My > Membership&amp;amp;quot; link, and change your delivery option. Press &amp;amp;quot;Save > Changes&amp;amp;quot;.
    DAILY DIGEST OPTION will deliver one email > to you each day summarizing that day's messages.
    WEB ONLY OPTION will not deliver email; you > must visit the web site to view messages.
    > Your use of Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/

    >
  4. ratagonia

    ratagonia Guest

    When the high strength Kevlar/nylon 5.5mm cord first appeared in about 1987, many people were very excited to use it as a rappelling cord. Unfortunately, the brittle Kevlar fibers cut each other when the cord is bent under force. It was found that after 100 rappels, that the Kevlar fibers were reduced to dust.

    And the sheath is thin and easily cut.

    Not a good choice for rappelling, but makes a very stiff and expensive pull cord.

    Tom

    --- In canyons@y..., "rcwildone" <rcwildone@y...> wrote: > Michele,
    Unfortunately, neither dyneema (aka spectra in the U.S.) or kevlar > are good choices for rope/cord fibers. Both fibers have a very high > strength to weight ration, but they also have some negative > characteristics.
    Dyneema/spectra has a low melting point, so the heat of a descending > device can be harmful. Therefore, a rope/cord made from 100% > dyneema/spectra should not be used. BlueWater recently introduced an > 8mm rope called the Canyon Pro with a spectra core and a polyester > sheath. The polyester sheath provides protection from heat and > additional abrasion resistance. It also holds the price down a bit; a > 100% spectra rope would be very expensive.
    Kevlar fibers are brittle and have poor "flex endurance". The fibers > are strong when pulled in line, but as soon as you tie a knot in a > kevlar rope, it is weaker than nylon. And, because the fibers are > brittle, sooner or later they will break. Kevlar is not a good > choice, even if only used in the core of a rope/cord.
    I have used canyoning ropes made by Beal, Cousin and Millet, as well > as most American-made static ropes. By far, my favorites are the new > BlueWater ropes (8mm Canyon Pro and 9.2mm Canyon). Not sure if they > are available in Europe yet, but if you can get your hands on one, do > it.
    Rich
Similar Threads: Rappelling dyneema
Forum Title Date
General Discussion Rappelling sites along 89 Jul 4, 2023
Tech Tips and Gear Who is rappelling off burlap bags? May 31, 2021
General Discussion ">Rappelling: The most extreme sport! Jan 5, 2020
Accidents and Near Misses Wolfe County SAR Rappelling accident: July 4, 2019 Jul 8, 2019
Tech Tips and Gear HOODOO-SL Rappelling Device Jul 16, 2018
Tech Tips and Gear Recommend a basic rappelling rope for a beginner? Jun 6, 2018