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Preferred Methods for Ascending

Discussion in 'Archives - Yahoo Canyons Group' started by Chris Raver, Mar 28, 2002.

  1. Chris Raver

    Chris Raver Guest

    I used this setup to Ascend the final repel on Behinin canyon after the ropes would not pull. It works pretty well and is much lighter then my Petzl Expeditions, The only problem I had was the Prussic would tighten up and would be hard to loosen. At 200' off the ground this wasn't a good experience.

    I was ascending the final repel on Behunin once and several large Rocks fell from the Archway near the canyon exit. I didn't know where they were coming from at first but there would have been no way for me to get out of the way. Now I always ascend with a Combination of a Petzl Expedition and GriGri. That way If I need to drop quickly I can pull the ascender and Squeeze the GriGri. The GriGri goes right to the Harness and the Petzl Ascender goes to 1 leg.

    Thank you

    Chris s. Raver Microsoft Platform Support



    -----Original Message----- From: Bo Beck [mailto:bobeck@outdooroutlet.com] Sent: Thursday, March 28, 2002 7:37 AM To: Yahoo Canyons Group Subject: Re: [from Canyons Group] Prefered Methods for Ascending

    5 years ago Kirk Mauthner (Rigging for Rescue. com) showed me the Purcell Prussik System, 1 short foot prussik, 1 long foot prussik, and 1 med. harness prussik. I don't have the diagram here today, but will try to remember to bring it in, scan it and post it. Basically they are prussiks on prussiks; work equally well on 1 strand as they do on 2 strands. I have used them numerous times to ascend a single strand, until I could incorporate the 2nd strand. The foot prussiks make beautiful adjustible daisy chains, can be used as an emergency sling, etc. They dont weigh much, and are inexpensive. Bo

    ----- Original Message ----- From: jwoodcanyon jwoodcanyon@yahoo.com> To: <Yahoo Canyons Group> Sent: Wednesday, March 27, 2002 3:42 PM Subject: [from Canyons Group] Prefered Methods for Ascending

    > I'm new to the e-group, so if I'm asking question that has been > pondered and discussed many times, sorry for the redundancy.
    I was wondering if some of you could share your prefered methods for > ascending rope. There seems, for instance, to be a split among my > friends about the use of mechnical ascenders and the use of > bachman/prussik knots.
    I've started practicing ascending recently with bachman knots tied > around locking carabiners and both ropes. I make the top bachman knot > with a shoulder length sling wrapped three times around a carabiner, > and then I girth hitch another sling to that one. I take the girth > hitched sling and hook it into my harness via a carabiner.
    With the bottom ascending knot, I make a rewoven figure-8 loop in the > center of a strand of cordelette, and rig a bachman knot with that > loop. Then I take one end of the cordelette, make another figure-8 > loop, and loop that into my carabiner on my harness, next to the > girth > hitched sling. Finally, I take the other end of the cordelette, and > make a foot loop for one foot.
    So far, I have not had the greatest success with this system. My > lower > bachman keeps locking up too quickly, and then I find myself unable > to > reach the upper ascending knot. Hence, I'm dangling in the air > (luckily, I've been practicing fairly close to the ground).
    Any suggestions?
    Joseph P. Wood
    PS--Hypothetically, when one reaches the snag in the rope with the > ascenders, how does one go about getting back down the rope? In other > words, how does one rig the rappel device mid-way up the rope?
    I hope this posting isn't too elementary for this e-group.

    > To change your options, go to the Canyons Egroup page on yahoo: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/canyons/
    > This will require logging into Yahoo. Click on the "Edit My > Membership" link, and change your delivery option. Press "Save > Changes".
    DAILY DIGEST OPTION will deliver one email > to you each day summarizing that day's messages.
    WEB ONLY OPTION will not deliver email; you > must visit the web site to view messages.

    Your use of Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/

    >



    To change your options, go to the Canyons Egroup page on yahoo: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/canyons/

    This will require logging into Yahoo. Click on the "Edit My Membership" link, and change your delivery option. Press "Save Changes".



    WEB ONLY OPTION will not deliver email; you must visit the web site to view messages.



    Your use of Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
  2. Bo Beck

    Bo Beck Guest

    I've used the Gri-Gri/ Ascender setup as well, and I agree that it makes for a hasty retreat, but..... when going over a lip or rounded edge, I have difficulty in that I dont care to release my brake hand on the gri-gri whilst attempting to work the ascender up and thru the tensioned edge,(sometimes this necessitates using both hands and feet), because once unweighted the gri-gri could relax and create a small slip that would shockload the possibly ready-to-go snag in the rope. It is an easy system to ascend with though, agreed, and I like the hasty retreat aspect. Bo

    ----- Original Message ----- From: Chris Raver v-2crave@mssupport.microsoft.com> To: <Yahoo Canyons Group> Sent: Thursday, March 28, 2002 7:58 AM Subject: RE: [from Canyons Group] Preferred Methods for Ascending

    > I used this setup to Ascend the final repel on Behinin canyon after the > ropes would not pull. It works pretty well and is much lighter then my > Petzl Expeditions, The only problem I had was the Prussic would tighten up > and would be hard to loosen. At 200' off the ground this wasn't a good > experience.
    I was ascending the final repel on Behunin once and several large Rocks fell > from the Archway near the canyon exit. I didn't know where they were coming > from at first but there would have been no way for me to get out of the way. > Now I always ascend with a Combination of a Petzl Expedition and GriGri. > That way If I need to drop quickly I can pull the ascender and Squeeze the > GriGri. The GriGri goes right to the Harness and the Petzl Ascender goes to > 1 leg.
    > Thank you
    Chris s. Raver > Microsoft Platform Support

    -----Original Message----- > From: Bo Beck [mailto:bobeck@outdooroutlet.com] > Sent: Thursday, March 28, 2002 7:37 AM > To: Yahoo Canyons Group
    Subject: Re: [from Canyons Group] Prefered Methods for Ascending
    5 years ago Kirk Mauthner (Rigging for Rescue. com) showed me the Purcell > Prussik System, 1 short foot prussik, 1 long foot prussik, and 1 med. > harness prussik. I don't have the diagram here today, but will try to > remember to bring it in, scan it and post it. Basically they are prussiks on > prussiks; work equally well on 1 strand as they do on 2 strands. I have used > them numerous times to ascend a single strand, until I could incorporate the > 2nd strand. The foot prussiks make beautiful adjustible daisy chains, can be > used as an emergency sling, etc. They dont weigh much, and are inexpensive. > Bo
    ----- Original Message ----- > From: jwoodcanyon jwoodcanyon@yahoo.com
    To: <Yahoo Canyons Group
    Sent: Wednesday, March 27, 2002 3:42 PM > Subject: [from Canyons Group] Prefered Methods for Ascending

    I'm new to the e-group, so if I'm asking question that has been
    pondered and discussed many times, sorry for the redundancy.

    I was wondering if some of you could share your prefered methods for
    ascending rope. There seems, for instance, to be a split among my
    friends about the use of mechnical ascenders and the use of
    bachman/prussik knots.

    I've started practicing ascending recently with bachman knots tied
    around locking carabiners and both ropes. I make the top bachman knot
    with a shoulder length sling wrapped three times around a carabiner,
    and then I girth hitch another sling to that one. I take the girth
    hitched sling and hook it into my harness via a carabiner.

    With the bottom ascending knot, I make a rewoven figure-8 loop in the
    center of a strand of cordelette, and rig a bachman knot with that
    loop. Then I take one end of the cordelette, make another figure-8
    loop, and loop that into my carabiner on my harness, next to the
    girth
    hitched sling. Finally, I take the other end of the cordelette, and
    make a foot loop for one foot.

    So far, I have not had the greatest success with this system. My
    lower
    bachman keeps locking up too quickly, and then I find myself unable
    to
    reach the upper ascending knot. Hence, I'm dangling in the air
    (luckily, I've been practicing fairly close to the ground).

    Any suggestions?

    Joseph P. Wood

    PS--Hypothetically, when one reaches the snag in the rope with the
    ascenders, how does one go about getting back down the rope? In other
    words, how does one rig the rappel device mid-way up the rope?

    I hope this posting isn't too elementary for this e-group.




    To change your options, go to the Canyons Egroup page on yahoo:
    http://groups.yahoo.com/group/canyons/

    > This will require logging into Yahoo. Click on the "Edit My
    Membership" link, and change your delivery option. Press "Save
    Changes".

    DAILY DIGEST OPTION will deliver one email
    to you each day summarizing that day's messages.

    WEB ONLY OPTION will not deliver email; you
    must visit the web site to view messages.



    Your use of Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/





    > To change your options, go to the Canyons Egroup page on yahoo: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/canyons/
    > This will require logging into Yahoo. Click on the "Edit My > Membership" link, and change your delivery option. Press "Save > Changes".
    DAILY DIGEST OPTION will deliver one email > to you each day summarizing that day's messages.
    WEB ONLY OPTION will not deliver email; you > must visit the web site to view messages.

    Your use of Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/

    > To change your options, go to the Canyons Egroup page on yahoo: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/canyons/
    > This will require logging into Yahoo. Click on the "Edit My > Membership" link, and change your delivery option. Press "Save > Changes".
    DAILY DIGEST OPTION will deliver one email > to you each day summarizing that day's messages.
    WEB ONLY OPTION will not deliver email; you > must visit the web site to view messages.

    Your use of Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/

    >
  3. ratagonia

    ratagonia Guest

    As far as getting the proper lengths...

    Getting the lengths set right makes your rope climbing much more efficient. Some people use a daisy and/or an etrier - but I like to use shoulder length slings, since I always have a handful of them when I go canyoning.

    My upper ropeman is set up with 2-1/2 shoulder length slings. This goes to one or both feet. (obviously, that's 3 slings, one of which is doubled up to reduce the length).

    My lower ropeman is usually directly to my harness belay loop via a small Pearabiner. Unfortunately, going direct to the biner makes it very difficult to switch to rappel, so if that is a significant possibility, I put it on another doubled up sling.

    Thankfully rope climbing is rare, in my experience. It is nice to have your rig at hand and ready to set up quickly when needed, rather than screwing around trying to get the lengths right.

    Tom

    --- In canyons@y..., "Bo Beck" <bobeck@o...> wrote: > I've used the Gri-Gri/ Ascender setup as well, and I agree that it makes for > a hasty retreat, but..... when going over a lip or rounded edge, I have > difficulty in that I dont care to release my brake hand on the gri- gri > whilst attempting to work the ascender up and thru the tensioned > edge,(sometimes this necessitates using both hands and feet), because once > unweighted the gri-gri could relax and create a small slip that would > shockload the possibly ready-to-go snag in the rope. It is an easy system to > ascend with though, agreed, and I like the hasty retreat aspect. > Bo >
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