Send us a suggestion!

North Wash - No Kidding comments

Discussion in 'Utah' started by ratagonia, Feb 24, 2013.

  1. ratagonia

    ratagonia

    Messages:
    3,674
    Likes:
    4,188
    Location:
    Mount Carmel, Utah
    We tried to do it after recent rain, when it was muddy. Oh what a nightmare! We did the big initial rap, then took an hour to get 50' downcanyon to the side-exit. Getting the SandTrap to work woulda been impossible. Might warn against.

    Here's a couple pictures from a different trip you could toss in there.
    nokidding03. nokidding04. nokidding05. nokidding06. nokidding08. nokidding09.
  2. John Styrnol

    John Styrnol

    Messages:
    258
    Likes:
    58
    Location:
    Grand Junction, Colorado
  3. Kevin

    Kevin

    Messages:
    147
    Likes:
    75
    Ha! I remember that day. What a mess
  4. Canyonbug

    Canyonbug Outdoor Junkie!

    Messages:
    89
    Likes:
    101
    Location:
    Blanding, Utah
    Fun canyon, but not for the weak of heart, or talent.
  5. Sam G

    Sam G

    Messages:
    88
    Likes:
    57
    Location:
    Boulder, CO
    In the first pic, is that an incomplete tensionless hitch being used as a retrievable anchor? If so that's freakin' awesome.

    Do you just give the rope a good shaking from the bottom and it comes down?
  6. ratagonia

    ratagonia

    Messages:
    3,674
    Likes:
    4,188
    Location:
    Mount Carmel, Utah
    It is a Tom-special Triple-twist hitch. The rope is left rigged and picked up on the way back up.

    Tom
  7. Sam G

    Sam G

    Messages:
    88
    Likes:
    57
    Location:
    Boulder, CO
    Oh, sounds a lot safer and saner than what I was thinking haha.
    Tyler likes this.
  8. ratagonia

    ratagonia

    Messages:
    3,674
    Likes:
    4,188
    Location:
    Mount Carmel, Utah
    Or gear. A SandTrap makes it fairly straightforward.

    Tom
  9. TJ Cottam

    TJ Cottam Adventure Plus

    Messages:
    132
    Likes:
    115
    What is around the pull rope? and is it's purpose to reduce friction for the pull?
  10. ratagonia

    ratagonia

    Messages:
    3,674
    Likes:
    4,188
    Location:
    Mount Carmel, Utah
    We use an edge protector of some kind on the pull side, which decreases rope grooves, and decreases the force required to clean the trap.

    In this case, looks like a piece of 1" tubular. Generally we use a 3' piece of hose. If you fix a 10' piece of 8mm rope on the pull side of the Trap, you can put a piece of hose on that, then tie additional length on, as it is usually needed.

    Tom
  11. Deagol

    Deagol too many hobbies

    Messages:
    904
    Likes:
    525
    Location:
    Colorado
    what do people think of these? I use one and have no complaints.
  12. ratagonia

    ratagonia

    Messages:
    3,674
    Likes:
    4,188
    Location:
    Mount Carmel, Utah
    Do you use that for pull-down rappels?

    Tom
  13. Deagol

    Deagol too many hobbies

    Messages:
    904
    Likes:
    525
    Location:
    Colorado
    actually, I did once (at Fry Canyon).
    I went to pull and had a "Oh $*&%$ moment" when I realized that pulling to rope through the rapid would probably pull the rope protector off and leave it up there as littler. The rapid ended up being large enough that the rope protector actually stayed on!
    Also, If I use the Buckle and don't use a biner block setup, it obviously comes down right with the rope.

    But, I see the point in your question: the likelihood of it getting hung-up in a smaller rapide during a pull is a very real possibility.
  14. Cristina

    Cristina Cristina AmatDiSanFilippo

    Messages:
    45
    Likes:
    13
    Location:
    Salt Lake City, Utah
    Tom,
    I notice in the picture that Alicia rappelling kind of crowling and saw the same on Bob's wife Stephanie , when she used to be last on the sandtrap, it is how you rap out of the bag?
    what you do if there is an overhang? it will shock load the system?
  15. ratagonia

    ratagonia

    Messages:
    3,674
    Likes:
    4,188
    Location:
    Mount Carmel, Utah
    These are examples of "Rappelling Softly". An important skill to have, especially for us "Full Size" people. Minimize the force on the anchor, etc.

    If there is an overhang, it is important to rappel smoothly and not stop. Once moving, one should rappel just a little slower than one would go if falling...

    Certainly very important skills in a natural-anchor world.

    Tom
  16. GLD

    GLD

    Messages:
    95
    Likes:
    35
    Location:
    Denver occasionally
    What's the thought in terms of your speed? I think minimizing acceleration inputs (really deceleration inputs since accelerating downwards only decreases the anchor load) is most important, speed is immaterial.
  17. shane taylor

    shane taylor

    Messages:
    1
    Likes:
    0
    beautiful pictures!
  18. ratagonia

    ratagonia

    Messages:
    3,674
    Likes:
    4,188
    Location:
    Mount Carmel, Utah
    Correct! Deceleration is the villain. Therefore, one tends to accelerate downward. Less than the acceleration due to gravity. There is also a time component; the less time you are hanging on the anchor the better. So rapping with speed and especially rapping smoothly is a good idea.

    Tom
  19. ratagonia

    ratagonia

    Messages:
    3,674
    Likes:
    4,188
    Location:
    Mount Carmel, Utah
    There is also the possibility of the thing jamming in the rapide with your rope, resulting in a stuck rope.

    Tom
  20. GLD

    GLD

    Messages:
    95
    Likes:
    35
    Location:
    Denver occasionally
    There's an integration effect? I could perhaps see it with the sand/water trap where the force creates a difference potential and sand moves out of the trap, but I think creep is a non-issue in other instances.

    I usually advise people to rap slowly more so they feel in control. A lot of deceleration happens when people feel out of control when they go fast and put the brakes on hard.

    GLD
Similar Threads: North Wash
Forum Title Date
General Discussion Gear found, hog canyons north wash Oct 6, 2017
General Discussion Time to selectively bolt North Wash? May 22, 2017
Trip Reports Morocco Canyon. Northwash. Mar 11, 2017
Meet Up Canyon trip 3/11-3/17ish in the North Wash, Swell or Roost Feb 26, 2017
General Discussion Lost Pack in North Wash's Hog4/Miss Piggy Oct 20, 2016
General Discussion CAC Call Out for Volunteers • North Wash Conservation • March 19, 2016 Feb 17, 2016