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Discussion in 'Tech Tips and Gear' started by Mike, Feb 2, 2015.
Not a problem, as such, but there's going to be a weight and cost penalty on every trip ...
Relax. It'll all be bolted by then...
Exotic web roundup:
About weird webbing in canyons:
I've seen it all!
Lawn chair webbing
Pack strap webbing
One sketch webbing I've seen repeatedly over the years is a flimsy-looking (~0.75") white webbing that may be linked to the Power transmission industry. I don't have a photo, but will try to get one make one next time I see it. Maybe it has a gold tracer? Can't remember. Anyway, wondering about the provenance of that stuff. Sound familiar to anyone?
Rescued out of
Initials carved in...
You're probably referring to mule tape.
It's used for pulling electrical and utility lines. Cheap, static, dielectric.
Polyester, 1800-2500 lbs
Something like this?
It's not the worst option for anchors based on your list above. But definitely far from the best.
At $.04-$.07/ft, it's certainly economical...
Being white polyester, you won't find anything more UV and weather resistant. It could be left in a canyon, in the sun, in the water, for YEARS and still be good to go.... Haha!
I was quoting Toms website.
I changed suppliers, as the price went way up from my prior source (which had the 3500 lb rating). New-source 11/16" webbing is rated at 2500 lbs. (now fixed)
I agree to a certain point. And I was referring only to the claims of the original post. Its a little funny cause I was recently saying that I plan on getting away from technical discussions because thats not me really. Its like I might know about the material or stuff, but how to use it is a whole other just as important interrelated aspect hehehe. I dont rappel much as it is, lets put it that way. Im more of a navigation person, on the lookout for scenic waterfalls.
There has been a lot of good information presented here in this discussion.
I would like to pull back and look at the big picture.
First of all, the circus tent color is atrocious - yikes!!! Don't do this, people. Black, tan, grey - something that blends in is so much better, AND required by certain land managers.
But really the question is, what is the Average Joe canyoneer to do?
1. Very few people are experts on webbing, and as you can see, even they disagree. The take away for Average Joe is: use 1" tubular, if the anchor does not have 1" tubular or another well-established climbing-type webbing, then you really have ZERO idea how strong it is, and thus you should not trust your life to it.
2. Be prepared to replace all the anchors in any canyon you do. You never know what you will find out there.
3. Please carry out the detritus. Do not ADD webbing to an anchor (unless it is short), please remove untrustworthy webbing and pack it out. Replace with trustworthy webbing (if you need to use that anchor).
4. When you buy webbing, buy 1" tubular. Perhaps the salesperson will present you with other options - give them the stink-eye until they slink away back to their cave.
5. Whatever, when you come across a rigged anchor in the wild, please inspect the entire length of the webbing with a skeptical eye. Your life is at stake. If the webbing is smaller (like the 11/16" tubular), be more skeptical.
I, too, am an expert on webbing, and am sometimes SHOCKED by the crap we find out there. Jeez people!
Tubular webbing (as a design style) is inherently stronger and more durable for anchors than flat webbing. The tubular design allows it to maintain more strength when crossing over a sharp edge, and it also tends to hold knots better, being inherently softer.
There is Tubular webbing out there that is not suitable for anchors - such as the 1/2" aid tape a certain canyoneer proudly uses. I use this stuff for rigging up hooks, etc. but it is not suitable for more ambitious applications.
There is plenty of flat webbing that is plenty strong and durable enough for use as anchor materials. However, the Average Joe canyoneer is not in a position to judge which styles are suitable and which styles are not. 1" Tubular webbing is inexpensive and widely available, and is THE STANDARD. Don't confuse the world by using other styles of webbing into the picture.
The fiber that the webbing is made from makes a big difference and can be difficult to discern, even to experts. Some of the webbing in the original picture from Mike looks like polypropylene "boating" webbing - and this stuff is not very cut resistant and not very strong, and UVs out quickly as a bonus! But how would you know. Me, I can put a lighter on it and tell the difference by smell, but that is because I have spent many hours cutting webbing and ropes with the hot knife. Be thankful that you have not.
In more obscure canyons, I tend to carry the 2500 lb test 11/16" tubular which weighs half as much, and is not near as durable. I tend to also bring 1" tubular, because if you are making a deadman, many people are likely to use it without inspecting the webbing, so I consider it part of our duty of care to make those totally bomber.
That's the stuff, thanks!
More info from a muletape mfg (Neptco):
Rapterman, I give you permission to stop at the word "littered" -- you are getting carried away here . . .
Pooped in? I've seen it.
Orderville anyone, thats not even just the occasional poop either it happens alot there.
Believe it. Seen it. Don't care to dwell on it . . .