Send us a suggestion!

feeling loved

Discussion in 'Archives - Yahoo Canyons Group' started by Anton Solovyev, Jul 25, 2011.

  1. Just back from a long weekend in Zion NP.

    Ok, I understand, we could not go into Spry as two separate groups since we knew each other. Thanks, I guess, for just issuing us a ticket (x2) and letting continue. The money went to a good cause, hopefully.

    However, a ranger with a vehicle waiting for us for several hours (our guess) at the Left Fork trailhead to check a permit seems a little excessive. Nothing better to do with the resources, really?

    --

    Anton Solovyev
  2. Morgan

    Morgan Guest

    Just curious, how much were the tickets for? BTW, theres always rangers checking at the Left Fork trailhead.

    --- In Yahoo Canyons Group, Anton Solovyev <anton@...> wrote:
    Just back from a long weekend in Zion NP.
    Ok, I understand, we could not go into Spry as two separate groups since we knew > each other. Thanks, I guess, for just issuing us a ticket (x2) and letting > continue. The money went to a good cause, hopefully.
    However, a ranger with a vehicle waiting for us for several hours (our guess) at > the Left Fork trailhead to check a permit seems a little excessive. Nothing > better to do with the resources, really?
    --
    Anton Solovyev >
  3. $75 a piece. Each "leader" (the person on the permit) was issued one.

    Always rangers at Left Fork? Hmmm... It seems the time would be better invested by marking and building a trail (into Subway), for example.

    My first time in Subway, a wonderful place. Could not stop smiling happily in the potholes and terraces section. Good thing I did not have a camera, and was looking instead of taking pictures.

    Morgan wrote:

    > Just curious, how much were the tickets for? BTW, theres always rangers checking at the Left Fork trailhead.
    --- In Yahoo Canyons Group, Anton Solovyev <anton@...> wrote: >> Just back from a long weekend in Zion NP. >
    > Ok, I understand, we could not go into Spry as two separate groups since we knew >> each other. Thanks, I guess, for just issuing us a ticket (x2) and letting >> continue. The money went to a good cause, hopefully. >
    > However, a ranger with a vehicle waiting for us for several hours (our guess) at >> the Left Fork trailhead to check a permit seems a little excessive. Nothing >> better to do with the resources, really? >
    > -- >
    > Anton Solovyev

    --

    Anton Solovyev
  4. Ryan

    Ryan Guest

    --- In Yahoo Canyons Group, Anton Solovyev <anton@...> wrote:
    Just back from a long weekend in Zion NP.
    Ok, I understand, we could not go into Spry as two separate groups since we knew > each other. Thanks, I guess, for just issuing us a ticket (x2) and letting > continue. The money went to a good cause, hopefully.
    However, a ranger with a vehicle waiting for us for several hours (our guess) at > the Left Fork trailhead to check a permit seems a little excessive. Nothing > better to do with the resources, really?
    --
    Anton Solovyev >

    Seems like there must be more funds to run the Park these days - when I was on Kolob Resevoir Road mid June on a week day there was a ranger at both the top AND bottom of the Subway waiting to check permits...

    Ryan
  5. If the Park Service issues a fine to one group of violators by stationing a Ranger a Left Fork, it is highly likely that the fine- generated revenue covers all the expense of stationing the Ranger there.

    My understanding is that for 2010 & 2011 Zion N.P. is and has been committed to Subway Permit enforcement. If our country shuts down in a few days from budget issues, who knows what will happen on the Kolob Terrace Road.

    Dave
  6. I have done Subway numerous times and have never seen a ranger at either the entry or exit. One of the times we actually were looking for a ranger (two of us ran ahead) because an older gent in our group was having health issues. He came out slowly, well after dark,  and was ok but we didn't know that at the time we decided to go ahead. We had cars at both the start and end so our presense in the canyon was obvious.

    As for Spry, that is another issue that with a little planning can be avoided.





    ----- Original Message -----

    From: "Anton Solovyev" anton@solovyev.com> To: Yahoo Canyons Group Sent: Monday, July 25, 2011 5:13:30 PM Subject: Re: [from Canyons Group] Re: feeling loved

     



    $75 a piece. Each "leader" (the person on the permit) was issued one.

    Always rangers at Left Fork? Hmmm... It seems the time would be better invested by marking and building a trail (into Subway), for example.

    My first time in Subway, a wonderful place. Could not stop smiling happily in the potholes and terraces section. Good thing I did not have a camera, and was looking instead of taking pictures.

    Morgan wrote:

    > Just curious, how much were the tickets for? BTW, theres always rangers checking at the Left Fork trailhead.
    --- In Yahoo Canyons Group , Anton Solovyev <anton@...> wrote: >> Just back from a long weekend in Zion NP. >
    > Ok, I understand, we could not go into Spry as two separate groups since we knew >> each other. Thanks, I guess, for just issuing us a ticket (x2) and letting >> continue. The money went to a good cause, hopefully. >
    > However, a ranger with a vehicle waiting for us for several hours (our guess) at >> the Left Fork trailhead to check a permit seems a little excessive. Nothing >> better to do with the resources, really? >
    > -- >
    > Anton Solovyev

    --

    Anton Solovyev
  7. RAM

    RAM Guest

    --- In Yahoo Canyons Group, jabridaka@... wrote:

    I have done Subway numerous times and have never seen a ranger at either the entry or exit.

    Things have changed. Another pet peeve? Recently I entered and exited Yosemite Nation Park via Tioga Pass several times. Never was I asked to provide identification, proving my national park pass was mine. I asked about it and they said it was decided locally that it was too much of an intrusion and rude to assume that people were out to take advantage of the system and so what if a few did. It was not worth making others feel untrusted and inconvenienced. People wait on line too much already and shouldn't at a national park.....Refreshing. Hello Zion! Anyone listening?
  8. stefan

    stefan Guest

    On Aug 7, 2011, at 10:50 PM, RAM wrote:

    > -- In Yahoo Canyons Group, jabridaka@... wrote: >
    > .Refreshing. Hello Zion! Anyone listening?

    haha
  9. cardlaw22

    cardlaw22 Guest

    --- In Yahoo Canyons Group, "RAM" <adkramoo@...> wrote: > Things have changed. Another pet peeve? Recently I entered and exited Yosemite Nation Park via Tioga Pass several times. Never was I asked to provide identification, proving my national park pass was mine. I asked about it and they said it was decided locally that it was too much of an intrusion and rude to assume that people were out to take advantage of the system and so what if a few did. It was not worth making others feel untrusted and inconvenienced. People wait on line too much already and shouldn't at a national park.....Refreshing. Hello Zion! Anyone listening? >

    Ahh, yes...Zion Park Rangers (start German accent now) Ranger: "Good Morgan, may I see your papers?" Me: (Utah Accent) "Have I done anything wrong?" Ranger: "No, well, maybe but I need your papers anyvay.... your permit to be on this land." Me: "That would be the land that I own as an American?" Ranger: "You own?....hahahahahahahahahah. Now give me your papers..."

    It is so, so very un-American for the rangers to assume that we are law breakers. You see by approaching us, stopping us, demanding our papers, requires a reasonable suspicion that we are violating the law or are about to. At least in my world that is the law. Apparently that is not the case in kingdom of Zion National Park. Perhaps that is also why they get away with a lottery in Utah too (haha). The permit system and the ranger contact really, really bothers me and significantly impacts MY wilderness experience. Think about how many times we are stopped or delayed just to hike a stinkin' canyon. Stop, pay money or show pass to enter Park. Stop, wait in line and waste a canyoneering day trying to obtain a permit. Stop, show your papers. Stop again and show papers at the exit of the canyon. Is there any wonder why canyons just outside the part are receiving more pressure? All to preserve my wilderness experience. Whatever. I could live with the entrance fee and even a reasonable permit system but quit treating me as a suspected criminal.

    As Ram said, anyone listening in Zion????

    Scott Card, Spelled S-c-o-t-t C-a-r-d (Already on "the list" at the Park I am sure.)

    (Waydago Ram, you got me all stirred up on Monday morning... ;-) )
Similar Threads: feeling loved
Forum Title Date
Archives - Yahoo Canyons Group Feelings about Zion Interim Use Limits Dec 3, 2002
General Discussion Edward Abbey "I loved it... I loved it all" Nov 17, 2015