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dual diameter rope rapell

Discussion in 'Archives - Yahoo Canyons Group' started by neil wilkinson, May 31, 2003.

  1. Did I hear you correctly? I am imagining you tying two pieces of rope together and then rappin on a double strand. You say 10mm & 8mm. Where do you draw the line on dia. differences and why not just block it and rap single line or use a contingency anchor? If I'm using pull cords my set up would be 9.3mm and 6mm (obviously static) and I can't imagine wanting to rap that set-up as a double line.

    I rap on different diameter ropes all the time. Very rarely do I see them move.

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  2. beadysee

    beadysee Guest

    --- In Yahoo Canyons Group, neil wilkinson <mtngoat59102@y...> wrote: > Did I hear you correctly? I am imagining you tying two pieces of rope together and then rappin on a double strand. You say 10mm & 8mm. Where do you draw the line on dia. differences and why not just block it and rap single line or use a contingency anchor? If I'm using pull cords my set up would be 9.3mm and 6mm (obviously static) and I can't imagine wanting to rap that set-up as a double line.
    > I rap on different diameter ropes all the time. Very rarely do I see > them move.

    Most common for me is 9.4 - 9.7 and 7mm.

    Your 6mm a true static line, or a accessory cord?

    My new favorite rope is a 6mm bone dry static by Espirit, the "personal alpine escape" rope, or some such. I'd rap double with that as one cord, for sure.

    Why not block and rap single? Because in especially lower angle rock climbing terrain, I want both my ropes back. Using a low profile overhand knot (in line, aka the EDK) is much less prone to snagging or gettin' stuck than a biner block or some such. And, I think rappin' single can be tough on ropes.

    Brian in SLC
  3. Brian,

    Sorry for the confusion, the 6mm I mentioned is cord and not a true rope. I too use the EDK often(usually double because I'm a nervous guy) just never tried it w/varied dia. lines. While attaching smaller cord to a thicker rope I usually re-lace an 8 or use the double fisherman. Has anyone done some failure testing on the Overhand knot and ropes of different diameters? Most often I just use the fisherman and it jams nicely in a rapid and away we go. However, I can see your point where rope pull/snag might be an issue. Hmmmm, food for thought. Still not sure I like the idea of my 9mm/6mm combo as a double rap or even using an Overhand knot to tie them together. Anyone have any practical experience with a similar set-up? (9mm/6mm)

    Neil

    beadysee beadysee@yahoo.com> wrote: Your 6mm a true static line, or a accessory cord?

    Why not block and rap single? Because in especially lower angle rock climbing terrain, I want both my ropes back. Using a low profile overhand knot (in line, aka the EDK) is much less prone to snagging or gettin' stuck than a biner block or some such.



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  4. I used to use the double fishermans knot when using two ropes for a rappel but I read somewhere that an overhand knot was stronger and better for ropes of different diameter (I think I read it in this group). It was hard to trust at first because it looks like such a small and simple knot compaired to the double fishermans or double figure 8 but It's the only knot I use now. It's great because it does not get snagged or pulled across the rock when you retrieve the rope, when you pull the rope the knot turns up so there's really nothing to get caught.



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    -----Original Message----- From: beadysee [mailto:beadysee@yahoo.com] Sent: Monday, June 02, 2003 8:24 AM To: Yahoo Canyons Group Subject: [from Canyons Group] Re: dual diameter rope rapell



    --- In Yahoo Canyons Group, neil wilkinson <mtngoat59102@y...> wrote: > Did I hear you correctly? I am imagining you tying two pieces of rope together and then rappin on a double strand. You say 10mm & 8mm. Where do you draw the line on dia. differences and why not just block it and rap single line or use a contingency anchor? If I'm using pull cords my set up would be 9.3mm and 6mm (obviously static) and I can't imagine wanting to rap that set-up as a double line.
    > I rap on different diameter ropes all the time. Very rarely do I see > them move.

    Most common for me is 9.4 - 9.7 and 7mm.

    Your 6mm a true static line, or a accessory cord?

    My new favorite rope is a 6mm bone dry static by Espirit, the "personal alpine escape" rope, or some such. I'd rap double with that as one cord, for sure.

    Why not block and rap single? Because in especially lower angle rock climbing terrain, I want both my ropes back. Using a low profile overhand knot (in line, aka the EDK) is much less prone to snagging or gettin' stuck than a biner block or some such. And, I think rappin' single can be tough on ropes.

    Brian in SLC





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  5. beadysee beadysee@yahoo.com> wrote:

    My new favorite rope is a 6mm bone dry static by Espirit, the "personal alpine escape" rope, or some such. I'd rap double with that as one cord, for sure.





    Where did you get it? I can't seem to find it at http://www.espritropes.com/static.htm

    (Speaking of which, I'd be much obliged if anyone could point me towards any good deals on 9 mm dry static ropes. :)



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  6. beadysee

    beadysee Guest

    --- In Yahoo Canyons Group, Christopher Jain <cjain1000@y...> wrote: > beadysee <beadysee@y...> wrote:
    My new favorite rope is a 6mm bone dry static by Espirit, > the "personal alpine escape" rope, or some such. I'd rap double with > that as one cord, for sure.
    Where did you get it? I can't seem to find it at http://www.espritropes.com/static.htm
    > (Speaking of which, I'd be much obliged if anyone could point me towards any good deals on 9 mm dry static ropes. :)

    Got it at BD retail here in SLC. Chatted for a spell with the Epirit guys, its not on their site. Good stats. Less than 2kg per 60m. Which, if my math is good, works out to less than 33 g/m, which is a bit lighter than 7mm perlon and heavier than 6mm perlon. Claimed a 5% elongation, strength in the 2300-2800lb range. Is nylon construction.

    Seems pretty stiff, but, works well for me (have yet to rap on it alone). Dunno if it floats. Double dry, it might.

    Brian in SLC
  7. Not exactly a dry static, but pretty close and lot more durable than any dry treatment:

    http://www.gonzoguanogear.com/rope.html

    Haven't tried it, but will be testing some soon (8 mm).

    hank





    "beadysee" beadysee@yahoo.c To: Yahoo Canyons Group om> cc: Subject: [from Canyons Group] Re: dual diameter rope rapell 06/03/2003 09:02 AM Please respond to canyons





    --- In Yahoo Canyons Group, Christopher Jain <cjain1000@y...> wrote: > beadysee <beadysee@y...> wrote:
    My new favorite rope is a 6mm bone dry static by Espirit, > the "personal alpine escape" rope, or some such. I'd rap double with > that as one cord, for sure.
    Where did you get it? I can't seem to find it at http://www.espritropes.com/static.htm
    > (Speaking of which, I'd be much obliged if anyone could point me towards any good deals on 9 mm dry static ropes. :)

    Got it at BD retail here in SLC. Chatted for a spell with the Epirit guys, its not on their site. Good stats. Less than 2kg per 60m. Which, if my math is good, works out to less than 33 g/m, which is a bit lighter than 7mm perlon and heavier than 6mm perlon. Claimed a 5% elongation, strength in the 2300-2800lb range. Is nylon construction.

    Seems pretty stiff, but, works well for me (have yet to rap on it alone). Dunno if it floats. Double dry, it might.

    Brian in SLC



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  8. Interesting & decent price. What's a "push rope" as described on the site? The rope that is tied to the pull rope? -steve

    --- hmoon@petzl.com wrote:
    Not exactly a dry static, but pretty close and lot more durable than > any > dry treatment:
    http://www.gonzoguanogear.com/rope.html
    > Haven't tried it, but will be testing some soon (8 mm).
    hank >

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  9. In caving, a "push" trip is one in which the known boundaries of the cave are explored or "pushed".

    hank
  10. Hank,

    Thanks for the link and let us know how well this works because I'm thinking of getting some of this as well. Looks like "poor man's" canyon pro rope. :)

    hmoon@petzl.com wrote:

    Not exactly a dry static, but pretty close and lot more durable than any dry treatment:

    http://www.gonzoguanogear.com/rope.html

    Haven't tried it, but will be testing some soon (8 mm).

    hank



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  11. Christopher

    Used it this weekend; here's my 1st impressions:

    1. a bit stiff, but not unmanageable (8 mm size) 2. no noticeable stretch at all 3. high friction when wet (Shane said "too much friction" when using ATC-XP in high friction mode) - didn't try it dry. 4. did not pick up much water weight 5. dried rapidly 6. love the weight and size (esp. when Ryan carries it the whole way) My only concern at this point is that it's a bit bumpy. This has presented no practical problem so far, but the bumps will probably abrade quicker than other areas of the rope. My understanding is that the rope is bumpy b/c the mfg. uses untwisted core bundles to reduce cost. It's too early to give it an overall rating, so stay tuned.

    hank



    Christopher Jain <cjain1000@yahoo. To: Yahoo Canyons Group com> cc: Subject: Re: [from Canyons Group] Re: dual diameter rope rapell 06/10/2003 04:12 PM Please respond to canyons





    Hank,

    Thanks for the link and let us know how well this works because I'm thinking of getting some of this as well. Looks like "poor man's" canyon pro rope. :)

    hmoon@petzl.com wrote:

    Not exactly a dry static, but pretty close and lot more durable than any dry treatment:

    http://www.gonzoguanogear.com/rope.html

    Haven't tried it, but will be testing some soon (8 mm).

    hank



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    When you post, please change the Subject appropriately, to make reading and searching easier. You can use the following abbreviations: TRIP = Trip Report; BETA = Canyon Beta; PARTNER = Partner and/or Rides; ETHICS = Ethics; TECH = Technical Questions and Tips; BIZ = E Group Business; SALE = Stuff for Sale. Please use a Tilde ~ after the abbreviation, so we know you are coding for us, such as:

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  12. >>>>>>My only concern at this point is that it's a bit bumpy. This has presented no practical problem so far, but the bumps will probably abrade quicker than other areas of the rope. My understanding is that the rope is bumpy b/c the mfg. uses untwisted core bundles to reduce cost. It's too early to give it an overall rating, so stay tuned.

    Darn! I knew there had to be a fly in the ointment somewhere.

    Here is another alternative, but I don't know how well the braided sheath would wear. It is available in different diameters. http://www.sailnet.com/store/performance/item.cfm?pid=12631

    ====

    &nbsp; Christopher Jain <cjain1000@yahoo. To: Yahoo Canyons Group com> cc: Subject: Re: [from Canyons Group] Re: dual diameter rope rapell 06/10/2003 04:12 PM Please respond to canyons





    Hank,

    Thanks for the link and let us know how well this works because I'm thinking of getting some of this as well. Looks like "poor man's" canyon pro rope. :)

    hmoon@petzl.com wrote:

    Not exactly a dry static, but pretty close and lot more durable than any dry treatment:

    http://www.gonzoguanogear.com/rope.html

    Haven't tried it, but will be testing some soon (8 mm).

    hank



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    When you post, please change the Subject appropriately, to make reading and searching easier. You can use the following abbreviations: TRIP = Trip Report; BETA = Canyon Beta; PARTNER = Partner and/or Rides; ETHICS = Ethics; TECH = Technical Questions and Tips; BIZ = E Group Business; SALE = Stuff for Sale. Please use a Tilde ~ after the abbreviation, so we know you are coding for us, such as:

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