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Canyoneering abuse

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Scott Patterson, Mar 8, 2018.

  1. Scott Patterson

    Scott Patterson

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    So, my daughter and I went on a canyoneering trip recently to White Roost Canyon, Little Wildhorse/Bell, and Keg Springs Canyon. We had a great time. Shaylee said that she had a great time. She came home with a few minor scratches and minor bruises on her knees, which is pretty normal for technical canyons, especially with stemming (such as in the West Fork of White Roost). They are already long gone.

    Apparently someone from the school reported possible abuse. There were two visits from social workers and one visit from the police to our house, even though our daughter said that it was just from a fun canyoneering trip. I wasn't there, but my wife showed the officers photographs and facebook posts about the trip.

    Now my daughter is afraid to go canyoneering because someone might report it and she was afraid to talk to the social workers and police about canyoneering again (not afraid of the police, but just them investigating the family). Last minute, she decided to stay home from the last weekend.

    Abuse is a serious problem, but this is pretty ridiculous. Also, the parents who let their children stay home and play video games and watch TV are real abusers.

    This whole situation has been frustrating.
  2. Kevin

    Kevin

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    Man that is crazy. I'd be frustrated too.
  3. Ali Miller

    Ali Miller

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    !!!

    Sorry you're dealing with this Scott.
  4. 2065toyota

    2065toyota

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    My wife has had co-workers accusing the same thing. She tries to convince them that we are an outdoor family and when you hike, snowmobile, canyoneer, etc. You are going to come home with bruises on your arms and legs.
  5. gajslk

    gajslk

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    Bummer. How about signing her up for karate and blaming that sport?
  6. hank moon

    hank moon lovely ligatures

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    A friend in STG was accosted by police while dining with their kids at a local resto. Reason? An anonymous patron had interpreted a congenital facial blemish on one of the kids as a sign of abuse and summoned the police. The episode resulted in the (quite young) kids hiding under the table, terrified.
  7. Sandstoned

    Sandstoned

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    Its their job...teachers are legally mandated reporters. When something seems out of whack, they are to report. Once reported, one would assume the situation is investigated. Once there is no problem, everyone is happy and life moves on. I cant imagine their MO would be to harass parents for nothing...though I can understand how it may feel like that. But taken from the other side, far better to investigate and learn of a happy and healthy outdoor family such as yourselves, than to think of a kid falling through the cracks, suffering abuse daily, and having no life line to safety. Hence legally mandated reporters. Same as cops, doctors, etc. A nuisance perhaps, but the opposite is unthinkable.
    Scott Chandler likes this.
  8. 2065toyota

    2065toyota

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    Much more important to go see about child abuse than potential school shooters to do something about.
  9. Bill

    Bill ... Staff Member

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    What if these social workers caught a glimpse of @Ram 's outdoor/canyoneering attire? That guy looks like he was assaulted 10 times over :)
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  10. Scott Patterson

    Scott Patterson

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    Agreed, but the report wasn't from the teachers or anyone who worked at the school. It was from an out of shape student who doesn't get any physical activity. My daughter even told her it wad from canyoneering. There were only a few very minor scrapes and bruises on her knee. I do agree that any suspected real abuse should be investigated.
    Last edited: Mar 9, 2018
  11. Sandstoned

    Sandstoned

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    Toyota, I have no idea what your statement means, but I agree both are awful. Kinda like heart disease and cancer...both suck, but you dont abandon treating one and only focus on the other. Got to eradicate them both.

    Scott, my bad, I misread, I thought the teacher was noticing the canyon abuse.

    That said, GOD do I LOVE canyon abuse...I could go for a triple dose right now.

    Bill, agreed, Ram could be the poster boy for adult canyon and mountain abuse...his attire goes GREAT with the huge smile on his face!!!
    Bill likes this.
  12. Scott Patterson

    Scott Patterson

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    I didn't specify who it was, so no problem.
  13. clangingsymbol

    clangingsymbol

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    I have several CANYONS that have abused ME!!! Who do I report them too???!!!??? Child abuse is a serious problems that should be reported. I am sorry to hear your daughter is scared off now because of the visit by the police.

    I am taking my 6 year old daughter out this weekend with a friend to go climbing. I hope she gets used to rappelling enough that I will be able to take her down canyons soon. She already asked me a few months ago: "Daddy...can I climb a mountain with you?" My response: "No lady bug...but I will take you down a canyon one day!!!" I hope she never gets scared of a canyon because a police office visits her at home after a trip for the same reason!!!
  14. spinesnaper

    spinesnaper

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    Is there a list of canyons known to abuse children? Probably best to avoid those. Welcome to the nanny state.
  15. Tom Collins

    Tom Collins

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    While I do agree that having kids fall through the cracks would be worse, it sounds like the investigation wasn’t handled very well as it scared his daughter. In our efforts to seek out and stop the guilty we need to be very careful not to harm the innocent.
    Scott Chandler and Dave Melton like this.
  16. penmartens

    penmartens

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    Hey Scott,
    Dave mentioned seeing this post, so I thought I'd better check it out.
    I was there when Shaylee did her first rappel with dad! She was very brave!! I would hate to think her canyoneering days are over because of a mishandled investigation that has nothing to do with canyoneering.
    Are you still living in Craig? I would suggest a visual presentation (pics, gear, etc) about the beauty, joys, and challenges of canyoneering be given at the school. If it is a large school perhaps one of Shaylee's teachers would be willing to have it during class time. Try approaching the principal or a couple teachers and see if they can help you set this up. Also, try to get Shaylee involved so she can move on from the negative reaction of the authorities. Once adults (and students) see what your family does, this won't be repeated and Shaylee can once again enjoy the outdoors and canyons.

    All my best to you and your family,
    Penny
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  17. Scott Patterson

    Scott Patterson

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    Yes.

    Every year I give a presentation on Latin America to the school (at their request; they ask me every year). It doesn't show any canyoneering, but definitely shows Shaylee mountain climbing and watching an erupting volcano. Most students know she does this kind of stuff and the presentation is always a big hit.

    I can see if I can do a canyoneering one too. Shaylee and I have canyoned in Latin America, but I have gotten few photos because they were wet canyons.

    You too. We'll have to get together sometime in a canyon.
    hank moon and ratagonia like this.
  18. hlscowboy

    hlscowboy

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    The first canyon I took my kids down was Boltergist above Leeds. The first few raps are relatively short, but the last one is about 110' but feels like much more when you're standing at the stop due to a down climb directly after the last rap. My kids all went down just fine, but my wife's 2 kids were nervous so they wanted to go last. Even though they could hear the other kids squealing with delight, they were not happy campers. As I was sending the others down, they both kept telling me it was child abuse to make them do this. In the end, despite the nervousness, they had a blast as soon as they were on the rope and now they all love to go. Still I frequently tell that story and laugh about canyoneering being child abuse. Maybe it's a good thing I moved away from Craig or they might be showing up at my house too!

    On a serious note, I was the county attorney there and KNOW the law on child abuse in Colorado as I actually handled those cases for DSS and prosecuted several child abuse cases when I was a prosecutor. Visible injuries are only required to be reported/investigated when the explanation of how they occurred does not match up realistically with the observable injuries. In your case, your daughter's explanation was perfectly consistent with the observed injuries. While the overweight student may not have been able to make that determination, the social worker who took the report certainly should have. This is certainly overreaching on their part, especially given they showed up with police. At best this should have been resolved by having someone at the school ask your daughter about the injuries. Once she gave her reasonable explanation it should have ended. I'm sorry you had to go though this. If it's any consolation to your daughter, I would be happy to represent you pro bono the next time some one tries to claim canyoneering is child abuse!

    I completely agree with your assessment of the situation, frustrating and ridiculous. If it rears it's stupid head again, please don't hesitate to call me if you need some help dealing with them.
    ScottM, Kevin C, Rapterman and 2 others like this.
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